Bolsonaro Hiding in the Hungarian Embassy. Not Asylum, He Says, Maybe Love.

When we first looked at the surveillance footage, we were surprised.

There was a Hungarian ambassador in Brazil who walked around the embassy nervously. There was Jair Bolsonaro, the former president of Brazil – who had recently been banned from leaving the country due to an intense criminal investigation – arriving at the gate. There were embassy staff bustling around the guest area with linens and a coffee machine.

Then, for two days, there was Mr. Bolsonaro wandering around the parking lot, looking bored, and there were his bodyguards to get the pizza.

Given the circumstances – a politician facing arrest sleeping in a foreign embassy controlled by a political coalition – it had all the hallmarks of a man seeking political asylum. Foreign embassies can be considered a sovereign state and have historically been used as shelters for people fleeing arrest.

My colleague and I published an article to that effect, complete with clips from the photos.

In response, the lawyers of Mr. Bolsonaro issued a statement saying that he just went to the embassy to talk about politics. They said, any suggestion, “fake news.”

Alexandre de Moraes, the Brazilian Supreme Court judge leading the ongoing criminal investigation into the former president, later ruled that Mr. Bolsonaro did not break the law by sleeping in the embassy.

So when I sat down with Mr. Bolsonaro in an interview this week, I was eager to finally ask him why – during the festivities in Brazil, four days after the police confiscated his passport – he had decided to sleep in a small guest room. of the Hungarian Embassy.

Here is an excerpt of our exchange, translated from Portuguese and edited for clarity.

Why did you sleep in the Hungarian Embassy for two nights?

See, it was a question of time zones I was talking about. And that’s the last one.

But did you sleep there for two nights?

Yes.

Is that normal?

That’s for me to decide.

Don’t have a bed in Brasília? (Brasília is the capital of Brazil.)

I agree. I would argue with my wife. I don’t say. Just as I am talking to the authorities, I am not saying that I did it. There is no reward for me. Zero.

Have you ever slept in another embassy?

Who knows? I am friends with Israel. I agree with the countries of the Arab world. I won’t say what to do because that gives them a story to chase. I am a free citizen.

Alexandre de Moraes’ group wanted to arrest me because I left without a passport. You do not need a passport to enter the embassy.

You are a private citizen. He is also a president who talks about the importance of truth. So it’s natural to want to understand why you slept in a foreign embassy four days after the authorities searched your home.

They could arrest me during the search if they wanted. Whatever I do I try to hide them. Was it a refuge? Shelter? With asylum, you work directly with the president.

Was it a bid for asylum? It seems unusual to sleep in an embassy.

Isn’t it strange that I am being persecuted? All I can say is, the other side can follow me. I met with [President Viktor Orban of Hungary] in Argentina in [President Javier] Miley’s opening. I get along with him.

It was not my fault. If there was a crime, they would arrest me.

[The embassy’s surveillance footage also showed a person visit Mr. Bolsonaro for 38 minutes. A Brazilian news outlet later reported it was his son, Carlos. Carlos was in the room with us.]

Carlos, you visited your father, didn’t you? What’s going on?

Carlos Bolsonaro: I just talked to my dad about…

[Lawyer in the room interrupts to request to talk off the record.]

Jair Bolsonaro: Do you think I will have a problem leaving Brazil right now? Don’t have a passport? Are a ton of illegal immigrants coming to the United States? I am the captain of the army. I’m used to the difficulties.

OK. So you were at the embassy?

Who knows? Maybe I have a lover there.

I’m not trying to be difficult, but I care about the truth, and you say you care too. So I just want to understand.

It’s confidential. Maybe one day you will know.